First of the UL Old Oaks, Felled

[Zeebart21]

_ My own personal opinion is that cutting down old trees should never be taken lightly. I have gone to many campuses that are devoid of trees and are all concrete jungles of new construction. Having those oak trees on UL's campus really gives it a great southern feel.

With that being said, one of the general aspects of environmentalism is the proposition that we did not inherit the earth from our parents but are leasing it from our kids. Planting five new trees to take each one's place leaves the campus in a better posture, tree-wise then it previously is.

While I think the two most important features of UL's campus are red brick and oak trees, I think the University did its due diligence and took an environmentally sustainable course of action. _

thank you.

now on to the basketball game tonite and the football game tomorrow!!!

[CajunRed]

Well said. And, yes, now to basketball and football.

My own personal opinion is that cutting down old trees should never be taken lightly. I have gone to many campuses that are devoid of trees and are all concrete jungles of new construction. Having those oak trees on UL's campus really gives it a great southern feel.

With that being said, one of the general aspects of environmentalism is the proposition that we did not inherit the earth from our parents but are leasing it from our kids. Planting five new trees to take each one's place leaves the campus in a better posture, tree-wise then it previously is.

While I think the two most important features of UL's campus are red brick and oak trees, I think the University did its due diligence and took an environmentally sustainable course of action.

igeaux.mobi

[rhineaux]

_ thank you.

now on to the basketball game tonite and the football game tomorrow!!! _

Basketball and Football don't put the trees back in the ground, Z.

[CajunT]

_ My own personal opinion is that cutting down old trees should never be taken lightly. I have gone to many campuses that are devoid of trees and are all concrete jungles of new construction. Having those oak trees on UL's campus really gives it a great southern feel.

With that being said, one of the general aspects of environmentalism is the proposition that we did not inherit the earth from our parents but are leasing it from our kids. Planting five new trees to take each one's place leaves the campus in a better posture, tree-wise then it previously is.

While I think the two most important features of UL's campus are red brick and oak trees, I think the University did its due diligence and took an environmentally sustainable course of action. _

SlappyCajun, this is not directed at you, but the proposition of taking environmentalism lightly. There is a place in society for environmental consciousness. But this thread was started by a person that clearly reacts on emotions and not fact. Had this person taken the time to get all the facts on the project and not use misinformation to gather attention to their protest, perhaps others like me would take their passion a little more seriously. It’s clear that this group will not accept the planting of new trees as a viable solution and will stand against the project regardless of this commitment by the university.

In light of the news I received earlier just minutes ago from a friend concerning the death of their 2 month old child due to SID’s, pardon me if I find some lunacy in this thread. I love trees; I just don’t love them more then people.

[SlappyCajun]

_ SlappyCajun, this is not directed at you, but the proposition of taking environmentalism lightly. There is a place in society for environmental consciousness. But this thread was started by a person that clearly reacts on emotions and not fact. Had this person taken the time to get all the facts on the project and not use misinformation to gather attention to their protest, perhaps others like me would take their passion a little more seriously. It’s clear that this group will not accept the planting of new trees as a viable solution and will stand against the project regardless of this commitment by the university.

In light of the news I received earlier just minutes ago from a friend concerning the death of their 2 month old child due to SID’s, pardon me if I find some lunacy in this thread. I love trees; I just don’t love them more then people. _

T-

Facts are overrated. (j/k) I just had another though. Apparently these trees were sacrificed to renovate instead of completely demolish the older buildings. Therefore, how many trees (in lumber) were saved by not building completely from scratch.

[Zeebart21]

_ SlappyCajun, this is not directed at you, but the proposition of taking environmentalism lightly. There is a place in society for environmental consciousness. But this thread was started by a person that clearly reacts on emotions and not fact. Had this person taken the time to get all the facts on the project and not use misinformation to gather attention to their protest, perhaps others like me would take their passion a little more seriously. It’s clear that this group will not accept the planting of new trees as a viable solution and will stand against the project regardless of this commitment by the university.

In light of the news I received earlier just minutes ago from a friend concerning the death of their 2 month old child due to SID’s, pardon me if I find some lunacy in this thread. I love trees; I just don’t love them more then people. _

awful news Brian.. sorry for your friends loss...

[gorcajun]

I, too, enjoy the oak trees.

I guess before they get "too old" and stand in the way of progress, someone should produce a workorder to cut the oak trees around Cajunfield.

That would be the definition of VISION.

[Cajunbander]

I really doubt anything is going to change, the twin towers are about to be torn down, and the housing department's website is already advertising that the Taft Street Dorms will be open for the Fall 2011 semester. Just remember that the plans already had to be changed because the original plans had them bulldozing Hamilton Field (the band practice field) If you don't think the band is good now, imagine if they didn't have a place to practice. Now, I believe some of the oaks that are going to be felled are ones that were planted by Dr. Jim Foret 50 some years ago, but Jim Foret, Jr. is a professor at UL now, and I'm sure he would have been in talks with the administration about cutting down the trees his father planted.

The way the new dorms on Taft Street will be made, there will be a common area inside, with an oak tree in the middle, and treescaping around to create a place for students to gather and relax.

Now, the question, is it better to keep essentially four live oak trees that are on the back side of campus and never thought of or utilized, or is it better to plant 30 new trees, which might not be as big, but will eventually grow to be that big, and be used to study under and meet under, etc.?

[cajun4life]

_ I really doubt anything is going to change, the twin towers are about to be torn down, and the housing department's website is already advertising that the Taft Street Dorms will be open for the Fall 2011 semester. Just remember that the plans already had to be changed because the original plans had them bulldozing Hamilton Field (the band practice field) If you don't think the band is good now, imagine if they didn't have a place to practice. Now, I believe some of the oaks that are going to be felled are ones that were planted by Dr. Jim Foret 50 some years ago, but Jim Foret, Jr. is a professor at UL now, and I'm sure he would have been in talks with the administration about cutting down the trees his father planted.

The way the new dorms on Taft Street will be made, there will be a common area inside, with an oak tree in the middle, and treescaping around to create a place for students to gather and relax.

Now, the question, is it better to keep essentially four live oak trees that are on the back side of campus and never thought of or utilized, or is it better to plant 30 new trees, which might not be as big, but will eventually grow to be that big, and be used to study under and meet under, etc.? _

Oh geez, trees turned into a band post. lol The PoA is a great show band, but not a good football game band IMO. It is not nearly loud enough.

I don't care about the damn TREES! This project will enhance UL's campus and open up Cypress Lake to the rest of campus allowing it to flourish and that is the crown jewel of campus IMO. The oak trees are nice, but if this project would remove the "swamp" from campus then I'd be upset.

[NewsCopy]

Edwin Lewis Stephens, University of Louisiana's first president, had a passion for live oaks that he spread over his campus, imparted in his students and shared across the state.

The rest of the story

[CajunWonk]

_ I really doubt anything is going to change, the twin towers are about to be torn down, and the housing department's website is already advertising that the Taft Street Dorms will be open for the Fall 2011 semester. Just remember that the plans already had to be changed because the original plans had them bulldozing Hamilton Field (the band practice field) If you don't think the band is good now, imagine if they didn't have a place to practice. Now, I believe some of the oaks that are going to be felled are ones that were planted by Dr. Jim Foret 50 some years ago, but Jim Foret, Jr. is a professor at UL now, and I'm sure he would have been in talks with the administration about cutting down the trees his father planted.

The way the new dorms on Taft Street will be made, there will be a common area inside, with an oak tree in the middle, and treescaping around to create a place for students to gather and relax.

Now, the question, is it better to keep essentially four live oak trees that are on the back side of campus and never thought of or utilized, or is it better to plant 30 new trees, which might not be as big, but will eventually grow to be that big, and be used to study under and meet under, etc.? _

Being a viewer, I had to jump in finally here on RaginPagin after having done some review of the situation.

From what I'm told, Jim Foret, Jr. was pretty much left out of the process until the very end when the formal annoucements were made that we all saw Nov 1st. http://louisiana.edu/blogs/president/archives/520
He didn't consent to any removal of his dad's Foret Oaks circa 1952.

I saw the picture posted earlier in this thread that is estimated at 1927 (approx year of build of Buchanan Hall) There are multiple pictures in the La. Digital Libraries from Dr. Stephens collections and the earliest plane flyovers that took photography of the school in 1930. There are no Live Oaks in those except for the several along the first block or two of Johnston, and along "College Avenue" up to the Circle Drive. The Robert and Sidney Martin oaks are of different ages.
The photograph attached from earlier posting on this forum must be of an early to mid 1930's date, b/c what looks like a precursor to McLaurin gym had been constructed, however Old Mouton, Stephens and Broussard (late 30's) are not there, nor is OK Allen Hall, or Randolph, or Burke. Only the Judice Hall dorm (now Honors Lounge, saved from the demolition ball 10 years ago) is in the shot along with the old Brown-Ayres, DeClouet, Foster, etc.

So the image on this site shows the full ring of Live Oaks around the big St.Mary/McKinley/College/Johnston block, and the 1930's oaks are big enough to see clearly.

There are many oaks which have already been culled over the years, whether for parking lots or storms, maybe disease, or accidents or whatnot.
http://louisdl.louislibraries.org/cd...SOBOX=1&REC=13

Here's a good shot of the early campus in 1930:
http://louisdl.louislibraries.org/cd...ISOBOX=1&REC=5
Many of the photos are dated May 1930, but maybe there were errors in the exact dating.
The oaks in these pictures are mere specks.

We know there was a building boom in the late 30's from the WPA and other federal money trickling down to the states, this basically doubled the # of campus buildings at SLI.

So fast forward a mere 10-20 years later to the third great planting of live oaks on the reclaimed farmland that is UL...
Dr. Foret, Sr. planted the oaks on the McKinley/Tulane/Taft/St. Mary block in 1952. This part is well documented. All these have been dedicated in his honor by plaque on a large stone in front of Hamilton. He was thinking ahead. He gave them ample room to spread and develop the graceful Live Oak profile we know so well, and they were left with ample ground room to grow from. Basically, pavement, buildings, parking areas, compact the soil, stunting growth, sometimes killing the trees, breaking the roots, or suffocating them.

Well, of the Foret Oaks, Many were damaged during the work on the Taft Street Garage. Looks like with all this, they're cutting down one they didn't manage to run over last time with the trucks.
Thankfully, they're trying to do better, but that Tree Care policy and promise didn't happen for this go round without Foret putting his two cents in to insist it would happen. Go look at the roots of the century oaks around Girard Hall, it's not pretty. Not that pretty matters.
Once any tree, loses its feeder roots, there's really no fixing that. They can try to stimulate root growth out of what's left, but those main feeders run along the ground, and at the trunk go right up and then out into branches that mirror the roots. Kill the root, you kill the top. It usually takes 3-5 years to notice the decline taking hold. The 1st garage was opened in 2007.

The oaks that are being cut down are as follows:
1.) McKinley immediate in front of Credit Union circa 1952.
2.) Taft Street in front of parking lot circa 1952
3.) Taft Street in front of Denbo date uncertain (one of the so-called "diseased" oaks)(next to the dying Sycamore)
4.) Next to Bancroft on the corner of the X wing. Date: at least as old as the dorm. (another of the so-called "diseased" oaks.)
Both 3 and 4 either have some mushroom growth or lichen. This is normal. Go look at some of the REAL century oaks, those have mushrooms and lichen on them too. Are they diseased? Should they be removed? How about we remove one lane of Johnston Street so they can heal themselves....right, never will happen. Did y'all know that LaDOTD actually owns that right of way where the Johnston Century Oaks are located. They've promised never to use it though. That's why the much ballyhooed Johnston St. Boulevard was never going to be a boulevard btwn downtown and St. Mary.
5.) McKinley Street - there is a row of 3 oaks from Harris Hall up to the corner with University Ave. The middle oak will be removed, kinda strange, the building will go into the gap between the other two....probably will damage those two in the process. Oaks don't grow deep, they grow wide under the surface, farther than the branches.
6.) There is apparently one or two oaks, either in the gap between Evangeline and Buchanan which will be removed or it is the one in the courtyardish area between Bonin and Harris.
Seems like some earlier planted where Harris is were removed long before maturity.

So #5 and #6 maybe no more than 80 years, probably no less than 70.

All these oaks are mature, and appear to meet 8 feet circumferance to be admitted into the Live Oak Society. Some of the Foret oaks are more substantial than some of the Century Oaks. http://www.louisianagardenclubs.org/los.html <--Live Oak Society page

These oaks have seen UL through name changes from SLI, to USL, to UL. They have been with us longer than most of the people who now live in Lafayette, myself included. The visual legacy cannot be restored once taken. Y'all better like seeing a parking garage right up to the curb, not elegantly set back like the Taft garage. Seems that this should have been an open process all along, especially if they've been working on it since the spring.

Much of the upset would have been averted if they used the Architecture dept or something and made it publicly announced. They've done work like this all over the region.
Having said that, much has been going at light speed this year with the budget meltdown, and I definitely think UL has been working overtime to get ahead of that curve to better make our case next year in the legislature.

BTW, the contractor, Ambling Companies from Georgia (the one that built University Courtyard (now Campus Crossings) and "The Edge" on Bertrand) is involved in this work. To see comparisons of their work from around the country: http://www.ambling.com/
http://www.amblingunivdevgroup.com/
http://www.ambling.com/news/articles...to-add-housing

Looks like several schools in La. have already worked with them to build up capacity.
The financing varies, but is usually handled through an external non-profit entity, just like UL is doing with Ragin Cajun Facilities, Inc.

These dorms will be stick-frame construction, 4 stories tall like River Ranch apartments.
UL is probably exempt from City of Lafayette building inspection. Hopefully they'll bring them in, but inspections slow down jobs. Especially these, have to be open by next August.

At any rate, an oak tree is more than the sum of it's parts (board feet) and together they are part of and form a consistent tapestry in the urban fabric, delineating the street from the more restive space, helping to define the buildings.

Finally, it's too bad those clowns at the Daily Advertiser messed up the story again as usual, but to be expected in general for all the media, there is a sort of sudden "fog of war" quality to all this where the reporters are struggling to get accurate information. Also not to be forgotten is that the draft plans and the final plans haven't really been shown to the wider public, so how can they get the story right. The numbers keep changing for that reason. Everyone that knew what they were talking about from the beginning knew these weren't the century+10 oaks. Only the media managed to screw that up. However, some of these (next to Bonin/Harris) "may" have been planted by Dr. Stephens. That much is uncertain, but possible. Maybe that will come out. (but then the old guard tried to say the Horse Farm's barn was built in 1940....) Records are sometimes fuzzy, but not that fuzzy.
Most of us will be dead in 60 years. That's how long it will take to grow these back. We'll never get that back in our lives. Think for the future.....try not to sacrifice the past. Past is future.

Just need to let the sunshine in and have some trust. It'll all unfold as it should and work out in the end, like Mr. Spock in Star Trek would say.

I think this addressed all the posts I intended to address in one fell swoop. HaH, is that a lumberjack's pun?!

[Turbine]

Wow CajunWonk, great post.

OK I uploaded the correct 1927 picture.

The other pic belongs in 1932

igeaux.mobi