Should a coach be held responsible for losing a money game?

[CajunProud]

_ We need to just worry about what we can control. Can we improve? yes. Has the program as a whole under performed? IMO yes. Change is happening. If you can't see it, you are either blind or can't be satisfied. Give it time gents. We just got the RCAF going, we've got renovations in the works, our football team beat a BCS school and is getting a little bit of respect from LSU fans which has never happened in my lifetime. Is Rickey the guy for the future? I don't think so but he has gotten us to where we are now and I'm happy for now. JMO. Evaluate after the season. _

Great post and I agree 100%. While I don't think Bustle is the guy to get us to the "next level", he has done a very good job considering the mess he inherited. I'll wait for final judgment until after the last play of the season.

[rhineaux]

_ Turbine, I have never disagreed with any of your posts. This one I do, when you state that you understand the rationale.
I don't buy that. Granted we get a large payout, but to say that accepting these enticements means that we are willing to accept a loss is, I hate to say this, ludicrous.
You are still welcome to visit the us at the Krewe de Chew tailgating site. _

I have to disagree with you, CC...although I think there is a little grey area somewhere in this argument.

There is a reason why one team stays home and writes a big check, and another takes a trip and cashes a big check. While teams on UL's side of the equation sometimes upset (key word) the bigger program, it doesn't happen often. They have millions of dollars, they have top notch facilities, they can afford more in the way of support staff, they make money on these games even with the check they write to their opponent, etc. In fact, I'd be willing to bet that just their take from annual bowl payouts and other payments for just being in a BCS conference is enough to cover their annual money games.

So, while the AD might think there's potential for upset when he/she schedules the game, and while the coaches and players prepare and work as though it is any other game, when the game has been played and it goes like it has the last two weeks, I'm sure that they walk away with some amount of acceptance. They may not be proud of the result, they may replay missed opportunities in their heads for a little while, but at the end of the day, they are likely aware of the nearly impossible task that was before them. And perhaps "accept" isn't the most accurate term to use, but I think that there is a vastly different feeling amongst the players, the coaches, the administration, etc when they walk out of a stadium after losing 31-3 or 55-0 to a Top 25 opponent, as compared to walking out of a stadium after losing 31-3 or 55-0 to a SBC opponent.

[zephyr]

_ Great post and I agree 100%. While I don't think Bustle is the guy to get us to the "next level", he has done a very good job considering the mess he inherited. I'll wait for final judgment until after the last play of the season. _

The question is.....What is your measuring stick? What do you use to evaluate his performance for this season? Personally, I believe that if people "expected" this team to get 7-8 wins this season, they are being only moderately delusional. I'm not saying it can't be done but to expect it with the youth on this team is just not reasonable IMO. We can all say that we will wait until the end of the season to judge, and that is the most logical process but how will many of us judge him? That is the question.

Many, if not most here believe that Bustle is probably not the guy to take us to a much higher level but do acknowledge what he's done for the program in his time here and I'm thankful for that. However, to me, this is NOT a year to judge him as he's having to mentor young QB's, RB's and WR's while having to manage another triage of injuries on defense which is to the point of humor quite honestly. I understand this and accept it and for those who simply reply that we must be able to plug new players in and expect the same production that we got from previous players is ludicrous.

It sounds like the same old quote that many people hate but......I will wait until after next season to judge. The defense will be the best we've had here with their blend of speed and experience along with lots of depth and the skill positions on offense will have had a year to gel and improve and I think the offense will be worlds better next year. While I won't expect 8 wins unfortunately due to OOC games against Ole Miss, OK state and Georgia, I will expect us to win conference and 7 wins for sure.

[zephyr]

_ I have to disagree with you, CC...although I think there is a little grey area somewhere in this argument.

There is a reason why one team stays home and writes a big check, and another takes a trip and cashes a big check. While teams on UL's side of the equation sometimes upset (key word) the bigger program, it doesn't happen often. They have millions of dollars, they have top notch facilities, they can afford more in the way of support staff, they make money on these games even with the check they write to their opponent, etc. In fact, I'd be willing to bet that just their take from annual bowl payouts and other payments for just being in a BCS conference is enough to cover their annual money games.

So, while the AD might think there's potential for upset when he/she schedules the game, and while the coaches and players prepare and work as though it is any other game, when the game has been played and it goes like it has the last two weeks, I'm sure that they walk away with some amount of acceptance. They may not be proud of the result, they may replay missed opportunities in their heads for a little while, but at the end of the day, they are likely aware of the nearly impossible task that was before them. And perhaps "accept" isn't the most accurate term to use, but I think that there is a vastly different feeling amongst the players, the coaches, the administration, etc when they walk out of a stadium after losing 31-3 or 55-0 to a Top 25 opponent, as compared to walking out of a stadium after losing 31-3 or 55-0 to a SBC opponent. _

I think it is pretty obvious that this is accurate by comments made by Bustle after the LSU game. He was proud of the team and especially "happy" that our team was upset they lost. I think that says something if the head coach is pleased to see his team was upset with a loss. I'm not bashing it, I'm just making an observation so i think there is some level of understanding from coaches and administrators with games like this. Also, if we were to win, they would note how monumental the win would be for the program and their excitment with the outcome which doesn't come with a game that you "expect" to win.

[Frenchie35]

_ Well, unless you have an extra $50-$100,000,000.00 to drop into our Athletic Department then your statement is useless. _

We need about 50 rich bastards in this community to fork over that amount each and every year......And that's only $5mil if they give the larger amount. I remember reading about three or four years back that the team east of us needed funds to improve on a couple of athletic complexes. They sent the word out that they needed three to hand over $1mill each and several others to fork over $500K each. No peace meal of what you can give to help. They needed the big donors......I think they got it.....Now if we can convince the locals here with the big bucks to keep it in our (their) community instead of sending it east...

[Turbine]

_ We need about 50 rich bastards in this community to fork over that amount each and every year......And that's only $5mil if they give the larger amount. I remember reading about three or four years back that the team east of us needed funds to improve on a couple of athletic complexes. They sent the word out that they needed three to hand over $1mill each and several others to fork over $500K each. No peace meal of what you can give to help. They needed the big donors......I think they got it.....Now if we can convince the locals here with the big bucks to keep it in our (their) community instead of sending it east... _

That (donations) can and will happen when UL strings together a few back-to-back winning seasons.

Money games cost you money in the long run. They are like borrowing from a loan shark.

jmo

[CajunProud]

_ That (donations) can and will happen when UL strings together a few back-to-back winning seasons.

Money games cost you money in the long run. They are like borrowing from a loan shark.

jmo _

Spot on.

Our out of conference games should be against teams from CUSA and the MAC. These are teams that we have a legitimate chance of beating year in and year out.

[CajunProud]

_ The question is.....What is your measuring stick? What do you use to evaluate his performance for this season? Personally, I believe that if people "expected" this team to get 7-8 wins this season, they are being only moderately delusional. I'm not saying it can't be done but to expect it with the youth on this team is just not reasonable IMO. We can all say that we will wait until the end of the season to judge, and that is the most logical process but how will many of us judge him? That is the question.

Many, if not most here believe that Bustle is probably not the guy to take us to a much higher level but do acknowledge what he's done for the program in his time here and I'm thankful for that. However, to me, this is NOT a year to judge him as he's having to mentor young QB's, RB's and WR's while having to manage another triage of injuries on defense which is to the point of humor quite honestly. I understand this and accept it and for those who simply reply that we must be able to plug new players in and expect the same production that we got from previous players is ludicrous.

It sounds like the same old quote that many people hate but......I will wait until after next season to judge. The defense will be the best we've had here with their blend of speed and experience along with lots of depth and the skill positions on offense will have had a year to gel and improve and I think the offense will be worlds better next year. While I won't expect 8 wins unfortunately due to OOC games against Ole Miss, OK state and Georgia, I will expect us to win conference and 7 wins for sure. _

Excellent points.

My measuring stick is not necessarily the amount of wins this year, but how we play and execute on the field as well as the types of recruits we bring in. While I have been impressed with the way we have played thus far, I still have some major concerns with the coaching staff. For example, in the LSU game when we had the ball on the goal line and we chose to run up the middle on 4 straight attempts, this was pure idiocy. I don't know who did the play calling, but it didn't make any sense. This is the type of thing that concerns me and is really what I will base a majority of my opinion on as to whether Bustle should stay or go. I am not convinced that Bustle has the "coaching" ability to get us to the next level. I do feel that his fate should be decided at the end of this year though.

[4LSU]

Perhaps a better question would be, should fans be held responsible for a coach being required to play two money games a year?

[NOCajun]

Perhaps a better question would be, should fans be held responsible for a coach being required to play two money games a year?

While I may not like your affiliation, I have to agree with you. As long as we conrtinue to NOT sell out a 31,000-seat stadium, even when the team is GOOD, we will conrtinue to have to play "money-games". Also, as long as the head coach at this University (no matter WHO IT IS!) draws a salary that's lower than dirt and gets only minimal support from the U and it's fans... (A caveman could draw the appropriate conclusion here.)
igeaux.mobi

[Turbine]

_ Turbine, I have never disagreed with any of your posts. This one I do, when you state that you understand the rationale.
I don't buy that. Granted we get a large payout, but to say that accepting these enticements means that we are willing to accept a loss is, I hate to say this, ludicrous.
You are still welcome to visit the us at the Krewe de Chew tailgating site. _

Charlie you can disagree with me all day and I will still love you and think you are the best.

When I said "P$ I understand the rationale" the "$" in ps was for I understand the rationale of scheduling money games.

However I also feel this scheduling model (business model) very much "accepts a loss" to say otherwise is akin to the claiming you saw and liked the "Emperor's new clothes."

I understand the business model in that "you need the money to get by" but let's face it this business model will force you to live paycheck to paycheck. It accepts a loss.

jmo

[DrumRoll]

_ Perhaps a better question would be, should fans be held responsible for a coach being required to play two money games a year? _

That's a resounding YES...

Provide the support, attendance, and peer pressure on the administration...but be a fan and do your part to help, prior to exercising your right to complain.

Money games become part of an "impressive schedule" at a more advanced level of football program development, but for now they are a "necessary evil" for UL.